Monday, September 12, 2005

9/11 Come 9/12...

When I woke up yesterday morning, it was 9/11. I read the newspaper. I went to my preaching point and delivered a soul-stirring sermon to 12 people. I gave the invitation and nobody responded (publicly anyway). I went home, logged on to the internet, and read several discussion forum messages. Then I switched to reading bloggers. All the while I was mindful that yesterday was the fourth anniversary of 9/11, and the first time this anniversary has occurred on a Sunday.

I thought about writing a blog about 9/11 but couldn’t think of anything original or intelligent to write. After reading the paper, listening to the news on TV & radio, and reading 41 Baptist bloggers, I didn’t find a thing new or enlightening that had been written or said about 9/11. It’s 9/12 and I still don’t have anything original or intelligent to write in memory of 9/11. I doubt that I’m capable of writing anything like that, but a few dumb thoughts do come to mind.

I am not encouraged by propensity of many to blame President Bush for the screw-ups in the aftermath of 9/11. Lo these four years and a day after the fact, many people are coming up with wild conspiracy theories about what happened on 9/11. I have friends who espouse conspiracy theories about 9/11. They are convinced that the President knew about 9/11 before it happened. They are convinced that the President and high officials in the White House are complicit in a cover-up operation about 9/11.

The problem I have with the conspiracy theories is that those pushing them are confusing propaganda with facts. I'm not convinced that propaganda and fact are synonymous. Allow me to offer a couple of examples of what I mean.
1) In the 40's, 50's & '60's there were legions of people who believed that flying saucers were real. Many of these same people gave so-called first-hand accounts about being abducted by space-aliens in these flying saucers. They wrote gobs of books declaring all of this stuff to be "fact." It was simply propaganda because people wanted to believe that flying saucers were fact. To my knowledge none of the flying saucer stuff has ever been proven to be fact.

2) In the 60's, 70's, & 80's, fundamentalists like W. A. Criswell, Paul Pressler, Paige Patterson, William Powell, and many others were spreading propaganda about the SBC seminaries being over-run with liberal professors. They also spread propaganda about the denomination drifting radically toward liberalism, calling it fact. We know now (as many of us knew back then) that this nonsense was only so much propaganda. There was no fact to the propaganda that the seminaries were riddled with liberalism, or that the denomination was drifting radically to the left.
In my honest opinion, the propaganda of the 9/11 conspiracy theorists bears striking resemblance to the two examples given above. If these conspiracy theories turn out to be true, I'll grovel and repent in sackcloth and ashes. Meanwhile, I'm considering them to be mere propaganda.

I want to ask my friends what they are going to do if the conspiracy theories turn out to be false? Or what if they never prove the propaganda to be fact? Also, what would they do if they turn out to be true? Nothing is going to change. Those who perishd on 9/11/01 will never be brought back to life. Those people are history. Furthermore, there's nothing they can do to Bush and his administration. He'll serve out his term and will fade into history just like all the other presidents of the past. Seems to me that the 9/11 conspiracy theorists are wasting time and energy on something that gains nothing for them.

The conspiracy theorists will go down in history just like the flying saucer believers. They will eventually be relegated to the fringe in history. In the end, they will be a flash-in-the-pan element in society just like the flying saucer people. That's my own personal opinion...

6 comments:

Speedzzter said...

Were the SBC fundamentalists merely peddling groundless propaganda?

Perhaps a look at a few of the "moderates" who left the SBC to form the "Cooperative Baptist Fellowship" will shed some objective light on the subject:

"Southern Baptists argued that the issue in the SBC controversy was theological in nature, it is important to note that theological liberalism does not operate in a vacuum or in a void, but that it manifests itself in various ways. This contrast demonstrates clearly that CBF is full of the manifestations of theological liberalism and provides a glimpse at what the Southern Baptist Convention would likely have looked like had the "conservative resurgence" never taken place.

* The SBC has no leaders that deny the deity of Christ, the need for His sacrificial death or the importance of His virgin birth.
But CBF does. http://www.sbcbaptistpress.org/bpnews.asp?ID=3773
* The SBC has no feminist theologian leaders calling for the worship of the "Christ-Sophia."
But CBF does. http://www.mbla.org/MBC97.htm#[2]
* The SBC has no leaders calling for the ordination of gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgendered persons.
But CBF does. http://www.mbla.org/vp49912.htm
* The SBC has no leaders declaring that God sometimes commands a woman to abort her unborn child for the purpose of population control.
But CBF does. http://www.mbla.org/MBC97.htm#[3]
* The SBC has no leaders advocating federal funding for abortions http://www.sbcbaptistpress.org/bpnews.asp?ID=1667 or the elimination of parental notification and parental consent laws so minors can have an abortion without their parent's knowledge.
But CBF does. http://www.mbla.org/vp2009.htm
* The SBC has no leaders proclaiming that the Bible does not condemn all forms of homosexual behavior.
But CBF does. http://www.mbla.org/MBC97.htm#[13]
* The SBC has no leaders calling for the ordination of women as senior pastors. http://www.mbla.org/MBC97.htm#[9]
But CBF does. http://www.cbfonline.org/forum/vestalonline.cfm?forumId=1080
* The SBC has no leaders that have worked in "coalition efforts" with Penthouse International, National Gay and Lesbian Task Force and Planned Parenthood.
But CBF does. http://www.mbla.org/vp4999.htm
* The SBC has no leaders who refer http://www.georgiaclergy.org/Archives/letters/200107/SBC20010710.htm to God as "Mother." http://www.sbcbaptistpress.org/bpnews.asp?ID=11230
But CBF does. http://www.sbcbaptistpress.org/bpnews.asp?ID=11243
* The SBC has no leaders that have signed a declaration stating that Biblical scholarship is an area of common ground between Baptists and atheistic "secular humanists." http://www.mbla.org/MBC97.htm#[5]
But CBF does. http://www.mbla.org/vp80011.htm
* The SBC has no leaders that have worked for the passage of such pro-homosexual legislation as the Employment Non-discrimination Act (ENDA) granting minority-status to homosexuals/bisexuals based solely on their sexual behavior.
But CBF does. http://www.mbla.org/bjcpa03.htm#ps
* The SBC does not embrace churches that ordain or "marry" homosexual persons.
But CBF does http://www.bpnews.net/bpnews.asp?ID=6686
* The SBC is aligned with no organization whose leaders have openly declared their support of the partial-birth abortion procedure http://www.mbla.org/vp2008.htm .
But CBF is. http://www.mbla.org/vp2009.htm
* The SBC is aligned with no organization that gave all of its "mission grants" (in 1997) to churches that welcome and affirm homosexuality.
But CBF is. http://www.mbla.org/vp4998.htm
* The SBC is aligned with no organization whose top leader has defended the reproduction and distribution of child pornography.
But CBF is. http://www.mbla.org/bjcpa04.htm"
http://www.mbla.org/controversy2.htm

David Flick said...

Speedzzter, the Missouri Baptist Layman's Association and the Baptist Press are nothing more than cheap, radical, fundamentalist propaganda organizations. They are a bunch of liars and out to destroy anyone who doesn't believe the Bible as they do. Neither organization has an ounce of credibility in the scheme of things. If you believe the propaganda junk they produce, then you are to be pitied...

Speedzzter said...

So nothing that they said was true?

What about these reports?

http://www.religioustolerance.org/hom_cbf.htm

"Hardy Clemons, former moderator of the moderate Cooperative Baptist Fellowship, wonders 'why someone would accuse Dr. [Kirby] Godsey of having a low Christology.'"

http://www.founders.org/FJ27/editorial.html

". . . the Cooperative Baptist Fellowship, a moderate group that affirms female pastors and other views disputed in the latest rewrite [of the Baptist Faith and Message]

http://www.baptiststandard.com/2000/7_10/pages/cbf_bfm.html

" Leaders of the Cooperative Baptist Fellowship have encouraged members to question the omniscience of God. In an “Open Theism” workshop at the CBF’s national meeting, liberal theologian Fisher Humphreys of Samford University and Pastor Phil Wise of First Baptist Church of Dothan, Alabama, ridiculed conservative Southern Baptist leaders who believe in the complete foreknowledge of Christ. According to Baptist Press, Humphreys said churches and schools should seriously consider the notion that God is “ignorant of the future.” Citing homosexual Anglican theologian Rowan Williams, Wise said, “Open theism may be the ‘least-worst way’ to understand God’s knowledge." Baptist Press reports most workshop participants seemed willing to embrace the open theist viewpoint during the question-and-answer time."

http://www.christianarsenal.com/demrpt/articles/CBFarticle.htm

"I heard talk of acceptance, tolerance, the possibility of more than one plan of salvation and the evil nature of exclusive claims in Christianity."

"Mind you, these views may or may not have been the viewpoints of the CBF's leadership. We will never know because the organization said it would not respond to questionable comments made during breakout sessions held at the CBF. I suspect that last year's fiasco with Reba Cobb's plagiarized sermon and the discovery of radical feminist literature on book tables at the general assembly resource fair birthed the statement."

"What the CBF thought a clever response to the journalistic inquiries of conservative Southern Baptists reveals the organization's tragically inconsistent approach to defining itself. In fact, they purposefully avoid verbally defining themselves in order to be as inclusive as possible and make a home for a hodgepodge of theological viewpoints, some of them simply heretical in relationship to classical Christianity." [In other words LUKEWARM WATER!]

http://bpnews.net/bpnews.asp?ID=16242

"However, there apparently isn't a problem with CBF churches which advocate homosexual lifestyles. Vestal confirmed there are at least three or four churches that send money to the CBF and have some kind of homosexual advocacy. He said the CBF nevertheless accepts donations from these churches."

"'We have not made that [homosexual issue] a litmus test for participation,' Vestal said. 'That does not mean that the CBF as an organization agrees with their positions.'"

"Vestal said he does not see a problem with accepting money from churches that openly endorse the homosexual lifestyle."

http://www.baptist2baptist.net/b2barticle.asp?ID=216

"The Wisdom of Daughters: Two Decades of the Voice of Christian Feminism, which was for sale in the CBF exhibit hall, is a full-orbed defense of the far-left of American religious feminism. The volume includes numerous essays advocating goddess worship, lesbianism, abortion rights, and even the integration of some elements of witchcraft into Christian spirituality. Moreover, the book was commended in materials distributed at the CBF by one of the organization's partner ministries, Baptist Women in Ministry (BWIM)."

http://www.baptist2baptist.net/b2barticle.asp?ID=90

"Ten Commandments displays on the Texas statehouse grounds and in courtrooms in two Kentucky counties are unconstitutional state endorsements of a religious message, argues [The Baptist Joint Committee for Religious Liberty](an entity funded in part by the CBF)

http://www.bjcpa.org/news/releases/2005/050302_t10c.htm

"The Interfaith Alliance is grateful for the overwhelming support we receive from religious leaders and people of faith across the nation, drawn from over 75 different faith traditions [Including the CBF]"

http://www.interfaithalliance.org/site/pp.asp?c=8dJIIWMCE&b=121584

"The Interfaith Alliance supports the 'Employment Non-Discrimination Act' (ENDA). ENDA would extend federal employment discrimination protections currently provided based on race, religion, sex, national origin, age and disability to sexual orientation. ENDA extends fair employment practices [sic]-- not special rights -- to lesbians, gay men, bisexuals and heterosexuals."

http://www.interfaithalliance.org/site/pp.asp?c=8dJIIWMCE&b=489633

"The worship service [at the annual meeting of Baptist Women in Ministry] featured a sermon by Carolyn Gordon, Director of Ministries for Higher Education for the DC Baptist Convention, on the sufficiency of God's grace. Gordon encouraged the women to "soar" in keeping with God's promises, remembering that "Her grace" is enough for them. The crowd roared when Gordon joked about her choice of a Pauline epistle as her text for the morning."

"'I'm reluctant to use Paul,' she said. 'He has not been our friend lately.'"

"One BWIM member told Baptist Press that the service was especially important as Cooperative Baptist women seek to respond to the SBC's new confessional statement."

"'We are taking Jesus' view of women over Paul's,' said Rev. Kristina Yeatts, associate pastor of First Baptist Church, Clayton, N.C. 'Adrian Rogers and Al Mohler are focusing way too much on the apostle Paul's letter rather than Jesus ... . We're talking about the Son of God vs. a biblical writer.'"

http://www.baptist2baptist.net/b2barticle.asp?ID=214

http://bpnews.net/bpnews.asp?ID=13738

David Flick said...

David ...the Missouri Baptist Layman's Association and the Baptist Press are nothing more than cheap, radical, fundamentalist propaganda organizations.

Speedzzter: So nothing that they said was true?

David: Like I said, these orginazations are nothing more than cheap, radical, fundamentalist propaganda organizations. They offer no credible news.

Speedzzter said...

So none of the incidents they reported ever happened?

None of the quotes they published are accurate?

There was no sermon from a female CBF leader plagerized from radical feminist literature?

There was no book for sale at a CBF convention that spoke of "goddesses" and other feminist heresy?

There was no BWIM meeting where the apostle Paul was attacked and slandered?

CBF does not support the Interfaith Alliance--a group which lobbies to make people who engage in GLBT sex acts a special "protected class" under federal law?

CBF does not support the BJCPA, which demands in briefs that non-sectarian historic monuments be stripped from the public square because they merely list the Ten Commandments?

The CBF had no breakout session on about "open theism?"

Daniel Vestal never said the CBF accepts money and cooperates with churches who ordain women or who encourage the homosexual lifestyle?

Hardy Clemons didn't ever defend heretical Mercer University President R. Kirby Godsey, who wrote "Jesus is not a god to be worshipped or the founder of a world religion to be admired"? http://www.whosoever.org/issue3/issue3_honest.html

(even Russell Dilday wouldn't defend Godsey's weak, heretical Christology!
http://www.sbts.edu/mohler/FidelitasRead.php?article=fidel029)

If you are correct, then none of these things ever happened, did they?

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